I'm trying to help as many as I can to do the right thing... just having
difficulty figuring out what that right thing is. Here's a case study from
last week. I post it just for info...

- a customer told me Movie Maker 6 on his new Vista system can't use the
video files from his camera, files he routinely used in MM2.1 in XP.

- I asked for the brand and model camera and a sample clip. The camcorder is
a Samsung PMP Digimax i6 6 Megapixel camera, and the clip he sent was an AVI
file from it.

- On my Vista Ultimate system, I double-clicked the file. WMP11 opens and
the file plays.... audio only... the video is blackness. Next to the clip's
name is a circled red X icon with a tool tip that said "Windows Media Player
encountered an error. Click the icon for more information".

- I clicked the icon to see "A codec is required to play the file. To
determine if the codec is available to download from the Web, click Web
Help". It provided a button named 'Web Help'.... I pressed it.

- That opened a Microsoft website page saying I've enountered error message
C00D10D1.... because the XVID MPEG-4 (XVID) coec is not installed...". "The
missing codec might be available to download from the Internet. To search
for the XVID MPEG-4 (XVID) codec see WMPlugins.com.".... It provides a link.

- The link to WMPlugins.com did the search for me. "Codec found".... the
page said it's version 1.0.2 last updated Nov 18, 2004, with a footnote
saying "Functionality may be limited on OSes other than Windows XP. See
partner site for details". It gives a link to the 'Xvid codec download
site', which I press.

- From there I accepted the notice that Microsoft is not at all responsible
for what happens next.... OK.... now I'm at an Xvid Movies site with two
Xvid codec links (Windows and Mac). The link says it's Xvid codec v1.1.3
for Windows. I download the small executable.

- When I run it, Vista gave me a security warning about the file not having
a valid digital signature that verifies the publisher.... OK

- The screen went black for a couple seconds, followed by a User Account
Control notice about an unidentified program wanting to access my
computer.... 'Allow'...

- I was then at the Xvid Setup Wizard... I accepted the GPU agreement...
then for info it tells me "... Remember, this binary is for educational
testing purposes only! You agree to keep me free of any (legal) issues
involved with downloading and using this binary!".... 'Next'....

- The installation was to c:\Program Files\Xvid... with no more warnings or
choices

- With the codec installed, I double-clicked the AVI file again... it played
fine in WMP11. But in Movie Maker 6 the audio part played but not the video.
It was time for a file conversion.

- I used VirtualDub to convert it... there are few compression choices
available to VirtualDub. Each made a file that played OK in WMP11, but acted
as an audio only file in Movie Maker 6. The available compression codecs
are....

- Microsoft Video 1
- Cinepak
- Intel IYUV-140
- Intel IYUV.

I fell back to using the Uncompressed option in VirtualDub.... the only file
that worked fine in both WMP11 and Movie Maker 6.

Taking the high road in Vista Ultimate, and doing the 'right thing' by
following each of the steps in the path that Microsoft pointed me to, ends
up doing a file conversion to an uncompressed file.... the starting clip was
8 MB in size and the uncompressed AVI file that I had to use in Movie Maker
was 1.07 GB for a 38 second clip.

The high road might be the right one, but it sure doesn't seem very
inviting. I guess this scenerio meets the criteria of using the codec for
'educational testing purposes only'. Does that mean I can't take the high
road if this was for one of my commercial projects?
--
website references are to www.papajohn.org

PapaJohn

it's Intel IYUV-1420, not 140

and there's another compression choice listed for VirtualDub... Microsoft
RLE... but it doesn't work. There are some notes in VirtualDub about why it
can't...

--
website references are to www.papajohn.org

PapaJohn


"PapaJohn" wrote in message
...
I'm trying to help as many as I can to do the right thing... just having
difficulty figuring out what that right thing is. Here's a case study from
last week. I post it just for info...

- a customer told me Movie Maker 6 on his new Vista system can't use the
video files from his camera, files he routinely used in MM2.1 in XP.

- I asked for the brand and model camera and a sample clip. The camcorder
is a Samsung PMP Digimax i6 6 Megapixel camera, and the clip he sent was
an AVI file from it.

- On my Vista Ultimate system, I double-clicked the file. WMP11 opens and
the file plays.... audio only... the video is blackness. Next to the
clip's name is a circled red X icon with a tool tip that said "Windows
Media Player encountered an error. Click the icon for more information".

- I clicked the icon to see "A codec is required to play the file. To
determine if the codec is available to download from the Web, click Web
Help". It provided a button named 'Web Help'.... I pressed it.

- That opened a Microsoft website page saying I've enountered error
message C00D10D1.... because the XVID MPEG-4 (XVID) coec is not
installed...". "The missing codec might be available to download from the
Internet. To search for the XVID MPEG-4 (XVID) codec see
WMPlugins.com.".... It provides a link.

- The link to WMPlugins.com did the search for me. "Codec found".... the
page said it's version 1.0.2 last updated Nov 18, 2004, with a footnote
saying "Functionality may be limited on OSes other than Windows XP. See
partner site for details". It gives a link to the 'Xvid codec download
site', which I press.

- From there I accepted the notice that Microsoft is not at all
responsible for what happens next.... OK.... now I'm at an Xvid Movies
site with two Xvid codec links (Windows and Mac). The link says it's Xvid
codec v1.1.3 for Windows. I download the small executable.

- When I run it, Vista gave me a security warning about the file not
having a valid digital signature that verifies the publisher.... OK

- The screen went black for a couple seconds, followed by a User Account
Control notice about an unidentified program wanting to access my
computer.... 'Allow'...

- I was then at the Xvid Setup Wizard... I accepted the GPU agreement...
then for info it tells me "... Remember, this binary is for educational
testing purposes only! You agree to keep me free of any (legal) issues
involved with downloading and using this binary!".... 'Next'....

- The installation was to c:\Program Files\Xvid... with no more warnings
or choices

- With the codec installed, I double-clicked the AVI file again... it
played fine in WMP11. But in Movie Maker 6 the audio part played but not
the video. It was time for a file conversion.

- I used VirtualDub to convert it... there are few compression choices
available to VirtualDub. Each made a file that played OK in WMP11, but
acted as an audio only file in Movie Maker 6. The available compression
codecs are....

- Microsoft Video 1
- Cinepak
- Intel IYUV-140
- Intel IYUV.

I fell back to using the Uncompressed option in VirtualDub.... the only
file that worked fine in both WMP11 and Movie Maker 6.

Taking the high road in Vista Ultimate, and doing the 'right thing' by
following each of the steps in the path that Microsoft pointed me to, ends
up doing a file conversion to an uncompressed file.... the starting clip
was 8 MB in size and the uncompressed AVI file that I had to use in Movie
Maker was 1.07 GB for a 38 second clip.

The high road might be the right one, but it sure doesn't seem very
inviting. I guess this scenerio meets the criteria of using the codec for
'educational testing purposes only'. Does that mean I can't take the high
road if this was for one of my commercial projects?
--
website references are to www.papajohn.org

PapaJohn

Maybe Vista or WMP11 should be labeled: "for educational testing purposes
only".

"PapaJohn" wrote in message
...
I'm trying to help as many as I can to do the right thing... just having
difficulty figuring out what that right thing is. Here's a case study from
last week. I post it just for info...

- a customer told me Movie Maker 6 on his new Vista system can't use the
video files from his camera, files he routinely used in MM2.1 in XP.

- I asked for the brand and model camera and a sample clip. The camcorder
is a Samsung PMP Digimax i6 6 Megapixel camera, and the clip he sent was
an AVI file from it.

- On my Vista Ultimate system, I double-clicked the file. WMP11 opens and
the file plays.... audio only... the video is blackness. Next to the
clip's name is a circled red X icon with a tool tip that said "Windows
Media Player encountered an error. Click the icon for more information".

- I clicked the icon to see "A codec is required to play the file. To
determine if the codec is available to download from the Web, click Web
Help". It provided a button named 'Web Help'.... I pressed it.

- That opened a Microsoft website page saying I've enountered error
message C00D10D1.... because the XVID MPEG-4 (XVID) coec is not
installed...". "The missing codec might be available to download from the
Internet. To search for the XVID MPEG-4 (XVID) codec see
WMPlugins.com.".... It provides a link.

- The link to WMPlugins.com did the search for me. "Codec found".... the
page said it's version 1.0.2 last updated Nov 18, 2004, with a footnote
saying "Functionality may be limited on OSes other than Windows XP. See
partner site for details". It gives a link to the 'Xvid codec download
site', which I press.

- From there I accepted the notice that Microsoft is not at all
responsible for what happens next.... OK.... now I'm at an Xvid Movies
site with two Xvid codec links (Windows and Mac). The link says it's Xvid
codec v1.1.3 for Windows. I download the small executable.

- When I run it, Vista gave me a security warning about the file not
having a valid digital signature that verifies the publisher.... OK

- The screen went black for a couple seconds, followed by a User Account
Control notice about an unidentified program wanting to access my
computer.... 'Allow'...

- I was then at the Xvid Setup Wizard... I accepted the GPU agreement...
then for info it tells me "... Remember, this binary is for educational
testing purposes only! You agree to keep me free of any (legal) issues
involved with downloading and using this binary!".... 'Next'....

- The installation was to c:\Program Files\Xvid... with no more warnings
or choices

- With the codec installed, I double-clicked the AVI file again... it
played fine in WMP11. But in Movie Maker 6 the audio part played but not
the video. It was time for a file conversion.

- I used VirtualDub to convert it... there are few compression choices
available to VirtualDub. Each made a file that played OK in WMP11, but
acted as an audio only file in Movie Maker 6. The available compression
codecs are....

- Microsoft Video 1
- Cinepak
- Intel IYUV-140
- Intel IYUV.

I fell back to using the Uncompressed option in VirtualDub.... the only
file that worked fine in both WMP11 and Movie Maker 6.

Taking the high road in Vista Ultimate, and doing the 'right thing' by
following each of the steps in the path that Microsoft pointed me to, ends
up doing a file conversion to an uncompressed file.... the starting clip
was 8 MB in size and the uncompressed AVI file that I had to use in Movie
Maker was 1.07 GB for a 38 second clip.

The high road might be the right one, but it sure doesn't seem very
inviting. I guess this scenerio meets the criteria of using the codec for
'educational testing purposes only'. Does that mean I can't take the high
road if this was for one of my commercial projects?
--
website references are to www.papajohn.org

PapaJohn

Being a writer and peer supporter, that's mostly what they are for me....
but then again, I do personal and commercial projects with them too.
--
website references are to www.papajohn.org

PapaJohn (MVP)


"Pat Riley" wrote in message
...
Maybe Vista or WMP11 should be labeled: "for educational testing purposes
only".

What would the playback experience here have been like on Windows XP or any
previous version of Windows?

--
Speaking for myself only.
See http://zachd.com/pss/pss.html for some helpful WMP info.
This posting is provided "AS IS" with no warranties, and confers no rights.
--

"Pat Riley" wrote in message
...
Maybe Vista or WMP11 should be labeled: "for educational testing purposes
only".

"PapaJohn" wrote in message
...
I'm trying to help as many as I can to do the right thing... just having
difficulty figuring out what that right thing is. Here's a case study
from last week. I post it just for info...

- a customer told me Movie Maker 6 on his new Vista system can't use the
video files from his camera, files he routinely used in MM2.1 in XP.

- I asked for the brand and model camera and a sample clip. The camcorder
is a Samsung PMP Digimax i6 6 Megapixel camera, and the clip he sent was
an AVI file from it.

- On my Vista Ultimate system, I double-clicked the file. WMP11 opens and
the file plays.... audio only... the video is blackness. Next to the
clip's name is a circled red X icon with a tool tip that said "Windows
Media Player encountered an error. Click the icon for more information".

- I clicked the icon to see "A codec is required to play the file. To
determine if the codec is available to download from the Web, click Web
Help". It provided a button named 'Web Help'.... I pressed it.

- That opened a Microsoft website page saying I've enountered error
message C00D10D1.... because the XVID MPEG-4 (XVID) coec is not
installed...". "The missing codec might be available to download from the
Internet. To search for the XVID MPEG-4 (XVID) codec see
WMPlugins.com.".... It provides a link.

- The link to WMPlugins.com did the search for me. "Codec found".... the
page said it's version 1.0.2 last updated Nov 18, 2004, with a footnote
saying "Functionality may be limited on OSes other than Windows XP. See
partner site for details". It gives a link to the 'Xvid codec download
site', which I press.

- From there I accepted the notice that Microsoft is not at all
responsible for what happens next.... OK.... now I'm at an Xvid Movies
site with two Xvid codec links (Windows and Mac). The link says it's
Xvid codec v1.1.3 for Windows. I download the small executable.

- When I run it, Vista gave me a security warning about the file not
having a valid digital signature that verifies the publisher.... OK

- The screen went black for a couple seconds, followed by a User Account
Control notice about an unidentified program wanting to access my
computer.... 'Allow'...

- I was then at the Xvid Setup Wizard... I accepted the GPU agreement...
then for info it tells me "... Remember, this binary is for educational
testing purposes only! You agree to keep me free of any (legal) issues
involved with downloading and using this binary!".... 'Next'....

- The installation was to c:\Program Files\Xvid... with no more warnings
or choices

- With the codec installed, I double-clicked the AVI file again... it
played fine in WMP11. But in Movie Maker 6 the audio part played but not
the video. It was time for a file conversion.

- I used VirtualDub to convert it... there are few compression choices
available to VirtualDub. Each made a file that played OK in WMP11, but
acted as an audio only file in Movie Maker 6. The available compression
codecs are....

- Microsoft Video 1
- Cinepak
- Intel IYUV-140
- Intel IYUV.

I fell back to using the Uncompressed option in VirtualDub.... the only
file that worked fine in both WMP11 and Movie Maker 6.

Taking the high road in Vista Ultimate, and doing the 'right thing' by
following each of the steps in the path that Microsoft pointed me to,
ends up doing a file conversion to an uncompressed file.... the starting
clip was 8 MB in size and the uncompressed AVI file that I had to use in
Movie Maker was 1.07 GB for a 38 second clip.

The high road might be the right one, but it sure doesn't seem very
inviting. I guess this scenerio meets the criteria of using the codec for
'educational testing purposes only'. Does that mean I can't take the high
road if this was for one of my commercial projects?
--
website references are to www.papajohn.org

PapaJohn

I don't have any 'out-of-the-box' XP or earlier systems to check it on, and
such info wouldn't help assess what to do when starting with a newly
installed Vista system.

My exercise was to see what happens with a clean system when following the
guidance from Microsoft. To its credit, WMP11 provided guidance and
pointers... Movie Maker 6 offers nothing in the way of pointers, error
messages or guidance.... and only successfully uses the uncompressed AVI
file from VirtualDub.

With the Xvid codec installed, DVD Maker accepts and successfully previews a
DVD using any of files, the Xvid one, and those created by VirtualDub using
the various available compression codecs.
--
website references are to www.papajohn.org

PapaJohn (MVP)


"zachd [MSFT]" wrote in message
...

What would the playback experience here have been like on Windows XP or
any previous version of Windows?

--
Speaking for myself only.
See http://zachd.com/pss/pss.html for some helpful WMP info.
This posting is provided "AS IS" with no warranties, and confers no
rights.
--

"Pat Riley" wrote in message
...
Maybe Vista or WMP11 should be labeled: "for educational testing
purposes only".

"PapaJohn" wrote in message
...
I'm trying to help as many as I can to do the right thing... just having
difficulty figuring out what that right thing is. Here's a case study
from last week. I post it just for info...

- a customer told me Movie Maker 6 on his new Vista system can't use the
video files from his camera, files he routinely used in MM2.1 in XP.

- I asked for the brand and model camera and a sample clip. The
camcorder is a Samsung PMP Digimax i6 6 Megapixel camera, and the clip
he sent was an AVI file from it.

- On my Vista Ultimate system, I double-clicked the file. WMP11 opens
and the file plays.... audio only... the video is blackness. Next to the
clip's name is a circled red X icon with a tool tip that said "Windows
Media Player encountered an error. Click the icon for more information".

- I clicked the icon to see "A codec is required to play the file. To
determine if the codec is available to download from the Web, click Web
Help". It provided a button named 'Web Help'.... I pressed it.

- That opened a Microsoft website page saying I've enountered error
message C00D10D1.... because the XVID MPEG-4 (XVID) coec is not
installed...". "The missing codec might be available to download from
the Internet. To search for the XVID MPEG-4 (XVID) codec see
WMPlugins.com.".... It provides a link.

- The link to WMPlugins.com did the search for me. "Codec found".... the
page said it's version 1.0.2 last updated Nov 18, 2004, with a footnote
saying "Functionality may be limited on OSes other than Windows XP. See
partner site for details". It gives a link to the 'Xvid codec download
site', which I press.

- From there I accepted the notice that Microsoft is not at all
responsible for what happens next.... OK.... now I'm at an Xvid Movies
site with two Xvid codec links (Windows and Mac). The link says it's
Xvid codec v1.1.3 for Windows. I download the small executable.

- When I run it, Vista gave me a security warning about the file not
having a valid digital signature that verifies the publisher.... OK

- The screen went black for a couple seconds, followed by a User Account
Control notice about an unidentified program wanting to access my
computer.... 'Allow'...

- I was then at the Xvid Setup Wizard... I accepted the GPU agreement...
then for info it tells me "... Remember, this binary is for educational
testing purposes only! You agree to keep me free of any (legal) issues
involved with downloading and using this binary!".... 'Next'....

- The installation was to c:\Program Files\Xvid... with no more warnings
or choices

- With the codec installed, I double-clicked the AVI file again... it
played fine in WMP11. But in Movie Maker 6 the audio part played but not
the video. It was time for a file conversion.

- I used VirtualDub to convert it... there are few compression choices
available to VirtualDub. Each made a file that played OK in WMP11, but
acted as an audio only file in Movie Maker 6. The available compression
codecs are....

- Microsoft Video 1
- Cinepak
- Intel IYUV-140
- Intel IYUV.

I fell back to using the Uncompressed option in VirtualDub.... the only
file that worked fine in both WMP11 and Movie Maker 6.

Taking the high road in Vista Ultimate, and doing the 'right thing' by
following each of the steps in the path that Microsoft pointed me to,
ends up doing a file conversion to an uncompressed file.... the starting
clip was 8 MB in size and the uncompressed AVI file that I had to use in
Movie Maker was 1.07 GB for a 38 second clip.

The high road might be the right one, but it sure doesn't seem very
inviting. I guess this scenerio meets the criteria of using the codec
for 'educational testing purposes only'. Does that mean I can't take the
high road if this was for one of my commercial projects?
--
website references are to www.papajohn.org

PapaJohn

Clearly on MM/XP he had third party software loaded to make that work. What
software was he using on that system?

Codec installation location here was just for their supporting binaries. If
you check HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\ SOFTWARE\Microsoft\Windows NT\CurrentVersion\
Drivers32 , value vidc.xvid , you'll note that it was installed to system32.

You're mixing apples and oranges by assuming that the playback filter that
the player points you to will work for editing too. The player codec
download system was never meant to ensure that your file editing works,
merely file playback.

The good behavior by vendors is to include a disc that would have the
software (codec) needed for playing and editing the content that the camera
produces: are you really saying that that camera didn't do that? That would
seem pretty unfriendly of the camera vendor. =(

--
Speaking for myself only.
See http://zachd.com/pss/pss.html for some helpful WMP info.
This posting is provided "AS IS" with no warranties, and confers no rights.
--

"PapaJohn" wrote in message
...
I'm trying to help as many as I can to do the right thing... just having
difficulty figuring out what that right thing is. Here's a case study from
last week. I post it just for info...

- a customer told me Movie Maker 6 on his new Vista system can't use the
video files from his camera, files he routinely used in MM2.1 in XP.

- I asked for the brand and model camera and a sample clip. The camcorder
is a Samsung PMP Digimax i6 6 Megapixel camera, and the clip he sent was
an AVI file from it.

- On my Vista Ultimate system, I double-clicked the file. WMP11 opens and
the file plays.... audio only... the video is blackness. Next to the
clip's name is a circled red X icon with a tool tip that said "Windows
Media Player encountered an error. Click the icon for more information".

- I clicked the icon to see "A codec is required to play the file. To
determine if the codec is available to download from the Web, click Web
Help". It provided a button named 'Web Help'.... I pressed it.

- That opened a Microsoft website page saying I've enountered error
message C00D10D1.... because the XVID MPEG-4 (XVID) coec is not
installed...". "The missing codec might be available to download from the
Internet. To search for the XVID MPEG-4 (XVID) codec see
WMPlugins.com.".... It provides a link.

- The link to WMPlugins.com did the search for me. "Codec found".... the
page said it's version 1.0.2 last updated Nov 18, 2004, with a footnote
saying "Functionality may be limited on OSes other than Windows XP. See
partner site for details". It gives a link to the 'Xvid codec download
site', which I press.

- From there I accepted the notice that Microsoft is not at all
responsible for what happens next.... OK.... now I'm at an Xvid Movies
site with two Xvid codec links (Windows and Mac). The link says it's Xvid
codec v1.1.3 for Windows. I download the small executable.

- When I run it, Vista gave me a security warning about the file not
having a valid digital signature that verifies the publisher.... OK

- The screen went black for a couple seconds, followed by a User Account
Control notice about an unidentified program wanting to access my
computer.... 'Allow'...

- I was then at the Xvid Setup Wizard... I accepted the GPU agreement...
then for info it tells me "... Remember, this binary is for educational
testing purposes only! You agree to keep me free of any (legal) issues
involved with downloading and using this binary!".... 'Next'....

- The installation was to c:\Program Files\Xvid... with no more warnings
or choices

- With the codec installed, I double-clicked the AVI file again... it
played fine in WMP11. But in Movie Maker 6 the audio part played but not
the video. It was time for a file conversion.

- I used VirtualDub to convert it... there are few compression choices
available to VirtualDub. Each made a file that played OK in WMP11, but
acted as an audio only file in Movie Maker 6. The available compression
codecs are....

- Microsoft Video 1
- Cinepak
- Intel IYUV-140
- Intel IYUV.

I fell back to using the Uncompressed option in VirtualDub.... the only
file that worked fine in both WMP11 and Movie Maker 6.

Taking the high road in Vista Ultimate, and doing the 'right thing' by
following each of the steps in the path that Microsoft pointed me to, ends
up doing a file conversion to an uncompressed file.... the starting clip
was 8 MB in size and the uncompressed AVI file that I had to use in Movie
Maker was 1.07 GB for a 38 second clip.

The high road might be the right one, but it sure doesn't seem very
inviting. I guess this scenerio meets the criteria of using the codec for
'educational testing purposes only'. Does that mean I can't take the high
road if this was for one of my commercial projects?
--
website references are to www.papajohn.org

PapaJohn

Yes, he must of had something to use his Xvid clips in MM2.1. I got him up
and running equally well on his new Vista system within a few minutes, by
having him download and install a codec.... not the one the WMP path took me
down.

Rather than study what came with his camera, I'd rather look at and enhance
my knowledge.... what should I have told him to do? Did I aim him toward a
'rogue' codec because I don't know how to tell the difference between a
rogue one and a good one? If a roque one works and the path I follow with
the Microsoft guidance doesn't, what do I put on my website to tell Movie
Maker users to do on their new Vista systems? The answer has to be the best
thing to do today, given the situation with his camera and his new Vista
system.

If it's conversion that I should be recommending, what tool(s) and what
compression codec(s) to use? With VirtualDub, only uncompressed works for my
MM6 on a Vista Ultimate system.... the price in file size... over a GB for
38 seconds, is too much. Should I be using the Windows Media Encoder to do
the conversion as it has access to WMV codecs and VirtualDub doesn't? Maybe
the new Expression Media Encoder would do it...

I may be mixing apples and oranges by looking at WMP to see what codec is
being used by Movie Maker.... but Movie Maker doesn't tell me anything, so I
need to use other things. Movie Maker has both playback and editing
features, so my assumption is about the playback feature, when viewing clips
in the collections, not when editing them in a project.

Answers lead to more questions. I just hope that 'thinking out loud' a bit
on this codec topic will help me and a few others in the long run.

Thanks for any and all comments...
--
website references are to www.papajohn.org

PapaJohn (MVP)


"zachd [MSFT]" wrote in message
...

Clearly on MM/XP he had third party software loaded to make that work.
What software was he using on that system?

Codec installation location here was just for their supporting binaries.
If you check HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\ SOFTWARE\Microsoft\Windows
NT\CurrentVersion\ Drivers32 , value vidc.xvid , you'll note that it was
installed to system32.

You're mixing apples and oranges by assuming that the playback filter that
the player points you to will work for editing too. The player codec
download system was never meant to ensure that your file editing works,
merely file playback.

The good behavior by vendors is to include a disc that would have the
software (codec) needed for playing and editing the content that the
camera produces: are you really saying that that camera didn't do that?
That would seem pretty unfriendly of the camera vendor. =(

--
Speaking for myself only.
See http://zachd.com/pss/pss.html for some helpful WMP info.
This posting is provided "AS IS" with no warranties, and confers no
rights.
--

"PapaJohn" wrote in message
...
I'm trying to help as many as I can to do the right thing... just having
difficulty figuring out what that right thing is. Here's a case study
from last week. I post it just for info...

- a customer told me Movie Maker 6 on his new Vista system can't use the
video files from his camera, files he routinely used in MM2.1 in XP.

- I asked for the brand and model camera and a sample clip. The camcorder
is a Samsung PMP Digimax i6 6 Megapixel camera, and the clip he sent was
an AVI file from it.

- On my Vista Ultimate system, I double-clicked the file. WMP11 opens and
the file plays.... audio only... the video is blackness. Next to the
clip's name is a circled red X icon with a tool tip that said "Windows
Media Player encountered an error. Click the icon for more information".

- I clicked the icon to see "A codec is required to play the file. To
determine if the codec is available to download from the Web, click Web
Help". It provided a button named 'Web Help'.... I pressed it.

- That opened a Microsoft website page saying I've enountered error
message C00D10D1.... because the XVID MPEG-4 (XVID) coec is not
installed...". "The missing codec might be available to download from the
Internet. To search for the XVID MPEG-4 (XVID) codec see
WMPlugins.com.".... It provides a link.

- The link to WMPlugins.com did the search for me. "Codec found".... the
page said it's version 1.0.2 last updated Nov 18, 2004, with a footnote
saying "Functionality may be limited on OSes other than Windows XP. See
partner site for details". It gives a link to the 'Xvid codec download
site', which I press.

- From there I accepted the notice that Microsoft is not at all
responsible for what happens next.... OK.... now I'm at an Xvid Movies
site with two Xvid codec links (Windows and Mac). The link says it's
Xvid codec v1.1.3 for Windows. I download the small executable.

- When I run it, Vista gave me a security warning about the file not
having a valid digital signature that verifies the publisher.... OK

- The screen went black for a couple seconds, followed by a User Account
Control notice about an unidentified program wanting to access my
computer.... 'Allow'...

- I was then at the Xvid Setup Wizard... I accepted the GPU agreement...
then for info it tells me "... Remember, this binary is for educational
testing purposes only! You agree to keep me free of any (legal) issues
involved with downloading and using this binary!".... 'Next'....

- The installation was to c:\Program Files\Xvid... with no more warnings
or choices

- With the codec installed, I double-clicked the AVI file again... it
played fine in WMP11. But in Movie Maker 6 the audio part played but not
the video. It was time for a file conversion.

- I used VirtualDub to convert it... there are few compression choices
available to VirtualDub. Each made a file that played OK in WMP11, but
acted as an audio only file in Movie Maker 6. The available compression
codecs are....

- Microsoft Video 1
- Cinepak
- Intel IYUV-140
- Intel IYUV.

I fell back to using the Uncompressed option in VirtualDub.... the only
file that worked fine in both WMP11 and Movie Maker 6.

Taking the high road in Vista Ultimate, and doing the 'right thing' by
following each of the steps in the path that Microsoft pointed me to,
ends up doing a file conversion to an uncompressed file.... the starting
clip was 8 MB in size and the uncompressed AVI file that I had to use in
Movie Maker was 1.07 GB for a 38 second clip.

The high road might be the right one, but it sure doesn't seem very
inviting. I guess this scenerio meets the criteria of using the codec for
'educational testing purposes only'. Does that mean I can't take the high
road if this was for one of my commercial projects?
--
website references are to www.papajohn.org

PapaJohn

Right, the design of the entire multimedia ecosystem never assumed that
people were going to be really random in their content choices. Movie Maker
'unfortunately' has the assumption that you're acquiring the content
yourself, which means you actually had the ability to produce/capture the
clip yourself. It's unfortunately not really designed to help you in your
codec acquisition.

You're getting the content that you want to use from some source. If we
were following best practices, they would have either given you the codec or
told you where to get it. The fact that they're not is a breakdown in the
overall multimedia ecosystem which is utterly vendor and operating system
agnostic.

--
Speaking for myself only.
See http://zachd.com/pss/pss.html for some helpful WMP info.
This posting is provided "AS IS" with no warranties, and confers no rights.
--

"PapaJohn" wrote in message
...
I don't have any 'out-of-the-box' XP or earlier systems to check it on, and
such info wouldn't help assess what to do when starting with a newly
installed Vista system.

My exercise was to see what happens with a clean system when following the
guidance from Microsoft. To its credit, WMP11 provided guidance and
pointers... Movie Maker 6 offers nothing in the way of pointers, error
messages or guidance.... and only successfully uses the uncompressed AVI
file from VirtualDub.

With the Xvid codec installed, DVD Maker accepts and successfully previews
a DVD using any of files, the Xvid one, and those created by VirtualDub
using the various available compression codecs.
--
website references are to www.papajohn.org

PapaJohn (MVP)


"zachd [MSFT]" wrote in message
...

What would the playback experience here have been like on Windows XP or
any previous version of Windows?

--
Speaking for myself only.
See http://zachd.com/pss/pss.html for some helpful WMP info.
This posting is provided "AS IS" with no warranties, and confers no
rights.
--

"Pat Riley" wrote in message
...
Maybe Vista or WMP11 should be labeled: "for educational testing
purposes only".

"PapaJohn" wrote in message
...
I'm trying to help as many as I can to do the right thing... just
having difficulty figuring out what that right thing is. Here's a case
study from last week. I post it just for info...

- a customer told me Movie Maker 6 on his new Vista system can't use
the video files from his camera, files he routinely used in MM2.1 in
XP.

- I asked for the brand and model camera and a sample clip. The
camcorder is a Samsung PMP Digimax i6 6 Megapixel camera, and the clip
he sent was an AVI file from it.

- On my Vista Ultimate system, I double-clicked the file. WMP11 opens
and the file plays.... audio only... the video is blackness. Next to
the clip's name is a circled red X icon with a tool tip that said
"Windows Media Player encountered an error. Click the icon for more
information".

- I clicked the icon to see "A codec is required to play the file. To
determine if the codec is available to download from the Web, click Web
Help". It provided a button named 'Web Help'.... I pressed it.

- That opened a Microsoft website page saying I've enountered error
message C00D10D1.... because the XVID MPEG-4 (XVID) coec is not
installed...". "The missing codec might be available to download from
the Internet. To search for the XVID MPEG-4 (XVID) codec see
WMPlugins.com.".... It provides a link.

- The link to WMPlugins.com did the search for me. "Codec found"....
the page said it's version 1.0.2 last updated Nov 18, 2004, with a
footnote saying "Functionality may be limited on OSes other than
Windows XP. See partner site for details". It gives a link to the 'Xvid
codec download site', which I press.

- From there I accepted the notice that Microsoft is not at all
responsible for what happens next.... OK.... now I'm at an Xvid Movies
site with two Xvid codec links (Windows and Mac). The link says it's
Xvid codec v1.1.3 for Windows. I download the small executable.

- When I run it, Vista gave me a security warning about the file not
having a valid digital signature that verifies the publisher.... OK

- The screen went black for a couple seconds, followed by a User
Account Control notice about an unidentified program wanting to access
my computer.... 'Allow'...

- I was then at the Xvid Setup Wizard... I accepted the GPU
agreement... then for info it tells me "... Remember, this binary is
for educational testing purposes only! You agree to keep me free of any
(legal) issues involved with downloading and using this binary!"....
'Next'....

- The installation was to c:\Program Files\Xvid... with no more
warnings or choices

- With the codec installed, I double-clicked the AVI file again... it
played fine in WMP11. But in Movie Maker 6 the audio part played but
not the video. It was time for a file conversion.

- I used VirtualDub to convert it... there are few compression choices
available to VirtualDub. Each made a file that played OK in WMP11, but
acted as an audio only file in Movie Maker 6. The available compression
codecs are....

- Microsoft Video 1
- Cinepak
- Intel IYUV-140
- Intel IYUV.

I fell back to using the Uncompressed option in VirtualDub.... the only
file that worked fine in both WMP11 and Movie Maker 6.

Taking the high road in Vista Ultimate, and doing the 'right thing' by
following each of the steps in the path that Microsoft pointed me to,
ends up doing a file conversion to an uncompressed file.... the
starting clip was 8 MB in size and the uncompressed AVI file that I had
to use in Movie Maker was 1.07 GB for a 38 second clip.

The high road might be the right one, but it sure doesn't seem very
inviting. I guess this scenerio meets the criteria of using the codec
for 'educational testing purposes only'. Does that mean I can't take
the high road if this was for one of my commercial projects?
--
website references are to www.papajohn.org

PapaJohn

Thanks much.... I appreciate your insights and perspective.
--
website references are to www.papajohn.org

PapaJohn (MVP)


"zachd [MSFT]" wrote in message
...

Right, the design of the entire multimedia ecosystem never assumed that
people were going to be really random in their content choices. Movie
Maker 'unfortunately' has the assumption that you're acquiring the content
yourself, which means you actually had the ability to produce/capture the
clip yourself. It's unfortunately not really designed to help you in your
codec acquisition.

You're getting the content that you want to use from some source. If we
were following best practices, they would have either given you the codec
or told you where to get it. The fact that they're not is a breakdown in
the overall multimedia ecosystem which is utterly vendor and operating
system agnostic.

--
Speaking for myself only.
See http://zachd.com/pss/pss.html for some helpful WMP info.
This posting is provided "AS IS" with no warranties, and confers no
rights.
--

"PapaJohn" wrote in message
...
I don't have any 'out-of-the-box' XP or earlier systems to check it on,
and such info wouldn't help assess what to do when starting with a newly
installed Vista system.

My exercise was to see what happens with a clean system when following
the guidance from Microsoft. To its credit, WMP11 provided guidance and
pointers... Movie Maker 6 offers nothing in the way of pointers, error
messages or guidance.... and only successfully uses the uncompressed AVI
file from VirtualDub.

With the Xvid codec installed, DVD Maker accepts and successfully
previews a DVD using any of files, the Xvid one, and those created by
VirtualDub using the various available compression codecs.
--
website references are to www.papajohn.org

PapaJohn (MVP)


"zachd [MSFT]" wrote in message
...

What would the playback experience here have been like on Windows XP or
any previous version of Windows?

--
Speaking for myself only.
See http://zachd.com/pss/pss.html for some helpful WMP info.
This posting is provided "AS IS" with no warranties, and confers no
rights.
--

"Pat Riley" wrote in message
...
Maybe Vista or WMP11 should be labeled: "for educational testing
purposes only".

"PapaJohn" wrote in message
...
I'm trying to help as many as I can to do the right thing... just
having difficulty figuring out what that right thing is. Here's a case
study from last week. I post it just for info...

- a customer told me Movie Maker 6 on his new Vista system can't use
the video files from his camera, files he routinely used in MM2.1 in
XP.

- I asked for the brand and model camera and a sample clip. The
camcorder is a Samsung PMP Digimax i6 6 Megapixel camera, and the clip
he sent was an AVI file from it.

- On my Vista Ultimate system, I double-clicked the file. WMP11 opens
and the file plays.... audio only... the video is blackness. Next to
the clip's name is a circled red X icon with a tool tip that said
"Windows Media Player encountered an error. Click the icon for more
information".

- I clicked the icon to see "A codec is required to play the file. To
determine if the codec is available to download from the Web, click
Web Help". It provided a button named 'Web Help'.... I pressed it.

- That opened a Microsoft website page saying I've enountered error
message C00D10D1.... because the XVID MPEG-4 (XVID) coec is not
installed...". "The missing codec might be available to download from
the Internet. To search for the XVID MPEG-4 (XVID) codec see
WMPlugins.com.".... It provides a link.

- The link to WMPlugins.com did the search for me. "Codec found"....
the page said it's version 1.0.2 last updated Nov 18, 2004, with a
footnote saying "Functionality may be limited on OSes other than
Windows XP. See partner site for details". It gives a link to the
'Xvid codec download site', which I press.

- From there I accepted the notice that Microsoft is not at all
responsible for what happens next.... OK.... now I'm at an Xvid Movies
site with two Xvid codec links (Windows and Mac). The link says it's
Xvid codec v1.1.3 for Windows. I download the small executable.

- When I run it, Vista gave me a security warning about the file not
having a valid digital signature that verifies the publisher.... OK

- The screen went black for a couple seconds, followed by a User
Account Control notice about an unidentified program wanting to access
my computer.... 'Allow'...

- I was then at the Xvid Setup Wizard... I accepted the GPU
agreement... then for info it tells me "... Remember, this binary is
for educational testing purposes only! You agree to keep me free of
any (legal) issues involved with downloading and using this
binary!".... 'Next'....

- The installation was to c:\Program Files\Xvid... with no more
warnings or choices

- With the codec installed, I double-clicked the AVI file again... it
played fine in WMP11. But in Movie Maker 6 the audio part played but
not the video. It was time for a file conversion.

- I used VirtualDub to convert it... there are few compression choices
available to VirtualDub. Each made a file that played OK in WMP11, but
acted as an audio only file in Movie Maker 6. The available
compression codecs are....

- Microsoft Video 1
- Cinepak
- Intel IYUV-140
- Intel IYUV.

I fell back to using the Uncompressed option in VirtualDub.... the
only file that worked fine in both WMP11 and Movie Maker 6.

Taking the high road in Vista Ultimate, and doing the 'right thing' by
following each of the steps in the path that Microsoft pointed me to,
ends up doing a file conversion to an uncompressed file.... the
starting clip was 8 MB in size and the uncompressed AVI file that I
had to use in Movie Maker was 1.07 GB for a 38 second clip.

The high road might be the right one, but it sure doesn't seem very
inviting. I guess this scenerio meets the criteria of using the codec
for 'educational testing purposes only'. Does that mean I can't take
the high road if this was for one of my commercial projects?
--
website references are to www.papajohn.org

PapaJohn