I have two fairly new (14 months and 10 months) Dell Inspiron 530 desktops.
Both run Vista Home Premium 32-bit. Not networked. The only hardware
differences between the two is in the processor and ram - one is a core 2
duo with 2 GB ram; the other is a core 2 quad with 4 GB ram. The quad,
right from the start, has always been quick to shut down - about 12 seconds
after the Shutting Down screen appears. The duo, on the other hand, has
always been slow to shut down - about 120 seconds.

Is there some diagnostic information I can pull from each system to compare?
It seems I'm in a good position to troubleshoot the slow shutdown with this
arrangement, but I can't quite figure out how to pull it all together. Any
suggestions would be appreciated...very appreciated.

Mike Moran wrote:

I have two fairly new (14 months and 10 months) Dell Inspiron 530
desktops.
Both run Vista Home Premium 32-bit. Not networked. The only hardware
differences between the two is in the processor and ram - one is a core 2
duo with 2 GB ram; the other is a core 2 quad with 4 GB ram. The quad,
right from the start, has always been quick to shut down - about 12
seconds
after the Shutting Down screen appears. The duo, on the other hand, has
always been slow to shut down - about 120 seconds.

Is there some diagnostic information I can pull from each system to
compare? It seems I'm in a good position to troubleshoot the slow shutdown
with this
arrangement, but I can't quite figure out how to pull it all together.
Any suggestions would be appreciated...very appreciated.

Shutdown issues are generally caused by a program and/or process that is
refusing to exit gracefully. The program and/or process can be from malware
or can be legitimate (such as an invasive antivirus like Norton or McAfee).
If you are using a Norton or McAfee product, uninstall it and replace with
a better program such as NOD32, Kasperksy, or Avast (free). The Windows
Firewall is adequate for most people. With Vista, shutdown issues can also
be caused by old/poorly written drivers so make sure all drivers are
updated. See Step B. below for general driver directions.

A.The first step is always to make sure your computer is virus/malware free.

http://www.elephantboycomputers.com/...moving_Malware

B. Drivers - The First Law of Driver Updates is "if it ain't broke, don't
fix it". Normally if everything is working you want to leave things as they
are. The exception is that heavy-duty gamers will usually want to update
their video and sound drivers to squeeze every last bit of performance out
of the hardware to get the fastest frame rates. If you're not one of those
people, you don't need to update your drivers if there are no problems you
are trying to solve.

Never get drivers from Windows Update. Get them from:

1. The device mftr.'s website; OR
2. The motherboard mftr.'s website if hardware is onboard; OR
3. The OEM's website for your specific machine if you have an OEM computer
(HP, Dell, Sony, etc.).

In your case, you would only get drivers from Dell.

Read the installation instructions on the website where you get the drivers.

To find out what hardware is in your computer:

1. Read any documentation you got when you bought the computer.
2. If the computer is OEM, go to the OEM's website for your specific model
machine and look at the specs (you'll be there to get the drivers anyway)
3. Download, install and run a free system inventory program like Belarc
Advisor or System Information for Windows.

http://www.belarc.com/free_download.html - Belarc Advisor
http://www.gtopala.com/ - System Information for Windows

C. If the computer is virus/malware-free, drivers are current, and no Norton
or McAfee programs are installed, then do clean-boot troubleshooting to see
which program/process is the culprit:

How to perform a clean boot in Vista and XP -
http://support.microsoft.com/kb/331796

D. If you need more information, here is an excellent shutdown
troubleshooter:

http://www.aumha.org/win5/a/shtdwnxp.htm

Malke
--
MS-MVP
Elephant Boy Computers - Don't Panic!
FAQ - http://www.elephantboycomputers.com/#FAQ

"Mike Moran" wrote in message
...
I have two fairly new (14 months and 10 months) Dell Inspiron 530
desktops. Both run Vista Home Premium 32-bit. Not networked. The
only hardware differences between the two is in the processor and
ram - one is a core 2 duo with 2 GB ram; the other is a core 2 quad
with 4 GB ram. The quad, right from the start, has always been
quick to shut down - about 12 seconds after the Shutting Down screen
appears. The duo, on the other hand, has always been slow to shut
down - about 120 seconds.

Is there some diagnostic information I can pull from each system to
compare? It seems I'm in a good position to troubleshoot the slow
shutdown with this arrangement, but I can't quite figure out how to
pull it all together. Any suggestions would be appreciated...very
appreciated.

"Mike Moran" wrote in message
...
I have two fairly new (14 months and 10 months) Dell Inspiron 530
desktops. Both run Vista Home Premium 32-bit. Not networked. The
only hardware differences between the two is in the processor and
ram - one is a core 2 duo with 2 GB ram; the other is a core 2 quad
with 4 GB ram. The quad, right from the start, has always been
quick to shut down - about 12 seconds after the Shutting Down screen
appears. The duo, on the other hand, has always been slow to shut
down - about 120 seconds.

Is there some diagnostic information I can pull from each system to
compare? It seems I'm in a good position to troubleshoot the slow
shutdown with this arrangement, but I can't quite figure out how to
pull it all together. Any suggestions would be appreciated...very
appreciated.

Turns out, I was clearing the pagefile on shutdown. Disabling that
option took care of the problem:

"Disable : "clear page file on shutdown" option, if enabled. Cleaning
the pagefile on every shutdown means overwriting the data by zeros,
and it takes time. To clear/not clear page file you can apply this
reg tweak. Back up registry before trying this. Start Run Regedit
GotoHKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SYSTEM\ CurrentControlSet\ Control\ Session
Manager\ Memory Management. Modify (if not present, rt click in open
space and create) the Value Data Type/s and Value Name/s :

Data Type: REG_DWORD [Dword Value]
Value Name: ClearPageFileAtShutdown
Setting for Value Data: [0 = Clear Page File Disabled / 1 = Clear Page
File Enabled]
Exit Registry and Reboot."

There is a bit of information available on shutdown in Event Viewer, check
Custom Views, Shutdown Problems.
Source: Diagnostics-Performance, Event ID 20x, Task Category: Shutdown
Performance

Michael


"Mike Moran" wrote in message
...


"Mike Moran" wrote in message
...
I have two fairly new (14 months and 10 months) Dell Inspiron 530
desktops. Both run Vista Home Premium 32-bit. Not networked. The only
hardware differences between the two is in the processor and ram - one is
a core 2 duo with 2 GB ram; the other is a core 2 quad with 4 GB ram.
The quad, right from the start, has always been quick to shut down -
about 12 seconds after the Shutting Down screen appears. The duo, on the
other hand, has always been slow to shut down - about 120 seconds.

Is there some diagnostic information I can pull from each system to
compare? It seems I'm in a good position to troubleshoot the slow
shutdown with this arrangement, but I can't quite figure out how to pull
it all together. Any suggestions would be appreciated...very
appreciated.

Turns out, I was clearing the pagefile on shutdown. Disabling that option
took care of the problem:

"Disable : "clear page file on shutdown" option, if enabled. Cleaning the
pagefile on every shutdown means overwriting the data by zeros, and it
takes time. To clear/not clear page file you can apply this reg tweak.
Back up registry before trying this. Start Run Regedit
GotoHKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SYSTEM\ CurrentControlSet\ Control\ Session
Manager\ Memory Management. Modify (if not present, rt click in open
space and create) the Value Data Type/s and Value Name/s :

Data Type: REG_DWORD [Dword Value]
Value Name: ClearPageFileAtShutdown
Setting for Value Data: [0 = Clear Page File Disabled / 1 = Clear Page
File Enabled]
Exit Registry and Reboot."

I had a similar shutdown problem with a Dell XPS

I read an article that suggested uncheck the system management, set any page
file settings to zero, reboot, delete any remaining page files left on your
drives, reboot again and then enable system management of the memory again.

It worked for me - page file clears itself on shutdown and creates a new one
on startup

Hope it helps
Andy

"Michael Walraven" wrote in message
...
There is a bit of information available on shutdown in Event Viewer, check
Custom Views, Shutdown Problems.
Source: Diagnostics-Performance, Event ID 20x, Task Category: Shutdown
Performance

Michael


"Mike Moran" wrote in message
...


"Mike Moran" wrote in message
...
I have two fairly new (14 months and 10 months) Dell Inspiron 530
desktops. Both run Vista Home Premium 32-bit. Not networked. The only
hardware differences between the two is in the processor and ram - one
is a core 2 duo with 2 GB ram; the other is a core 2 quad with 4 GB ram.
The quad, right from the start, has always been quick to shut down -
about 12 seconds after the Shutting Down screen appears. The duo, on
the other hand, has always been slow to shut down - about 120 seconds.

Is there some diagnostic information I can pull from each system to
compare? It seems I'm in a good position to troubleshoot the slow
shutdown with this arrangement, but I can't quite figure out how to pull
it all together. Any suggestions would be appreciated...very
appreciated.

Turns out, I was clearing the pagefile on shutdown. Disabling that
option took care of the problem:

"Disable : "clear page file on shutdown" option, if enabled. Cleaning the
pagefile on every shutdown means overwriting the data by zeros, and it
takes time. To clear/not clear page file you can apply this reg tweak.
Back up registry before trying this. Start Run Regedit
GotoHKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SYSTEM\ CurrentControlSet\ Control\ Session
Manager\ Memory Management. Modify (if not present, rt click in open
space and create) the Value Data Type/s and Value Name/s :

Data Type: REG_DWORD [Dword Value]
Value Name: ClearPageFileAtShutdown
Setting for Value Data: [0 = Clear Page File Disabled / 1 = Clear Page
File Enabled]
Exit Registry and Reboot."

I have a lot of experience of the many, many bugs of Vista and the
various machines that run it.

Mary Jo Foley is an excellent Microsoft "spotter". Here is her home
page:

http://blogs.zdnet.com/microsoft/

She says in one of her blogs that Microsoft are anxious to avoid the
"disinformation on the Internet", but are THEMSELVES the source of
that disinformation.
Their "updates" are supposed to meet the special wishes of the
customers. However, I found 42 separate "knowledge bases" (KB) on the
Microsoft site, all aimed at patching some of Microsoft's dud code.
The special wishes of the customers are simply for a system that
WORKS.

Using System Function 66, Subfunction 2, my own machine-code program
for antialiased line-drawing found the file size. There is no other
way. The file-size was wrong. I took a commercial graphics program to
determine the filesize of a BMP file, and it reported that it was
MINUS one BILLION, 285 MILLION, 230 THOUSAND and 262 BYTES. Vista LIED
to the commercial software and to mine.

This shows that the bugs are deep in the BIOS of the Vista operating
system. It is rotten to the CORE.

There is a mathematical concept known as "die Mengenlehre" in German,
translated as "Set Theory" into English. However, it is not theory.

An operating system consists of a huge "set" of subroutines. In Vista,
many are broken. The only solution is to find a "subset" of those
routines, that are NOT broken. Any patch must use the safe subset. You
cannot write massive programs, that rely on the full set - broken and
unbroken - to repair the system.

On the Microsoft site, they offer "Service Pack 1". This takes a
massive 455 megabytes - enough space to contain perhaps ten complete
operating systems. Not only that, it does not load. So it is all in
vain.

Similarly with the "Knowledge Bases". The various KB-numbers for the
"updates" contain such things as an "update that enables future
updates". So Microsoft have discovered that their "updates" do not
work. They should have noticed that BEFORE they launched 42 of them on
the Internet, not AFTER. Indeed, they should TEST their "products".
They should have tested Vista. They should have tested the "updates".
They should test everything.

They are obviously unaware, by analogy, that you cannot use a car
without an engine to drive off to fetch an engine. You cannot use a
car without fuel to drive off to fetch fuel. There is a "set" of vital
parts, like engine and fuel that make the driving possible.

So the "update to enable updates" cannot be an "update". Like Lord
Russell's "set of all sets", which is a "superset", so an "update to
enable updates" has to be a "super-update" that uses only safe
subroutines.

These things announce themselves as "standalone programs". However,
Microsoft has grown so accustomed to writing programs that run UNDER
an operating system that they have lost the plot. An "update" that
runs under a buggy BIOS is not "standalone". Ergo, it is not a "super-
update".

Part of the disinformation Mary-Jo Foley speaks of relates to who's to
BLAME. Here we see the official Microsoft blame-shifting:

http://gizmodo.com/373076/nvidia-res...rashes-in-2007

It is an invidious slander of NVIDIA to say that they are RESPONSIBLE
for 28.8% of all crashes. Just because 28.8% of all video cards are
NVIDIA does not prove that they are GUILTY of the Vista crashes. ONE
HUNDRED PERCENT of all machines showing Vista crashes were running
Vista.

My own experience of Vista on several Dells, each with an NVIDIA card
is that they did indeed crash. However, there was no evidence of a
VIDEO crash.

THE FIRST THING TO DO IS TO DISABLE THE UPDATES.

Several machines I was trying were crashing out of regular programs to
"configure updates". All data that had been entered was lost. They
always hung for a time saying "section 2 of 3, 28% completed" and then
"section 3 of 3, 98% completed". They even claimed to be fetching
"updates" when there was no way whatever that the machine could
contact the Internet. It was totally OFF-LINE.

One of the KB "updates" is said to address an irregularity in the
handling of the "servicing store", which interferes with the
installation of "updates", "Service Packs" and programs.

I take it that the "servicing store" is the modem buffer, with the
pointer set to a special place where the "servicing" data will be
stored. Anyway, if it is not on the Internet it is taking RANDOM BYTES
from the "servicing store" and scattering them around the operating
system. In this way, the number of broken subroutines INCREASES
instead of being reduced.

So the automatic updating system, being flawed, acts as a "Trojan
virus". The original bugs cause the system to corrupt itself further.

The closest I came to a useable operating system was what I got when I
disabled the automatic updates.

However. And here is the joke. For FIVE DAYS after I disabled the
automatic updates, it continued to pretend that it was fetching
updates. Only after five days did it notice. Thereafter, it keeps
sneaking a window into my line-of-sight encouraging me to switch them
back on, or download "updates" manually.

I downloaded many "updates" using XP, into an SD card. I virus-checked
them and tried to run them. NONE WORKED.

So much for Microsoft and its world monopoly of IBM-compatible
systems.

Charles Douglas Wehner

BS!