I agree with Susan. I need Microsoft Fax. I can't believe MS left it out of
Home Premium. Total BS. As for the Know It All, why post your smart a$$
remarks on here?

To continue to warn those who are considering updating to Vista to read the
fine print before they do. Those users who most frequently use the Windows
Fax product will now be left without it if they don't. Users for whom faxing
is important should stay with XP. I see a lot of folks who rush to the
latest releases just assuming it will be better or have more features--not
always true.
It is not realistic to post here and expect anyone here to be able to
provide a solution for this issue. Microsoft does not monitor these groups,
but it may still be reasonable to post your individual protest and leave it
at that. Sometimes they do "mine the data" here when considering future
policies. I can't help but wonder that they aren't a bit surprised by
finding out how many people actually used and valued the fax module.
--
Russ Valentine
[MVP-Outlook]
"Brian" Brian @discussions.microsoft.com wrote in message
...
I agree with Susan. I need Microsoft Fax. I can't believe MS left it out
of
Home Premium. Total BS. As for the Know It All, why post your smart a$$
remarks on here?

On Sat, 17 Mar 2007 08:49:08 -0400, "Russ Valentine [MVP-Outlook]"
wrote:

Microsoft does not monitor these groups,
but it may still be reasonable to post your individual protest

I would certainly like to add my comments to the others. As has been
said before, it is unreasonable to expect "upgraders" to read all the
fine print, one expects more features in new system, not fewer.

I won't be advising any of my clients to upgrade their PCs until
Microsoft comes up with a solution.

--
Nigel M

As a loyal Microsoft customer I find it very sad to read all the MVP
replies.

A basic rule of marketing is "the customer is always right". I am a
long-time customer, and I feel like I have been ripped off when a
feature which was available in Windows XP is no longer available in
the regular (or "cheap" if you like) versions of Windows Vista.

You can say as long as you want "read the fine-prints", "if you had
downloaded the large but free product manual you would have seen
that". However I do not read the fine prints of any product I buy. I
did read the comparison table at the Windows Vista home page, and it
said nothing about faxing. I have never planned to read a "large but
free" manual before making a choice of which version to buy.

You are calling the customers' complaints "bitching". This is very
insulting. It really feels like talking to a monopoly - "who cares
what the customer thinks, you should have known better." I know you
guys are not working for Microsoft, but you are holding a title given
by it and you do represent Microsoft in this newsgroup.

This is not the kind of attitude I am expecting to see from MVPs. You
can be helpful, link to alternative fax programs. If you can't be
helpful, you can just not reply.

On Mar 17, 2:49 pm, "Russ Valentine [MVP-Outlook]"
wrote:
To continue to warn those who are considering updating to Vista to read the
fine print before they do. Those users who most frequently use the WindowsFaxproduct will now be left without it if they don't. Users for whom faxing
is important should stay with XP. I see a lot of folks who rush to the
latest releases just assuming it will be better or have more features--not
always true.
It is not realistic to post here and expect anyone here to be able to
provide a solution for this issue. Microsoft does not monitor these groups,
but it may still be reasonable to post your individual protest and leave it
at that. Sometimes they do "mine the data" here when considering future
policies. I can't help but wonder that they aren't a bit surprised by
finding out how many people actually used and valued thefaxmodule.
--
Russ Valentine
[MVP-Outlook]"Brian" Brian @discussions.microsoft.com wrote in message

...



I agree with Susan. I need MicrosoftFax. I can't believe MS left it out
of
Home Premium. Total BS. As for the Know It All, why post your smart a$$
remarks on here?- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Just to be perfectly clear, I am an end user just like everyone else here. I
do not represent Microsoft in any way and know no more about its internal
operations than you do. I do know they do not monitor these groups directly.
It is only an assumption on my part that they might "mine the data" that
resides here. Microsoft is a very savvy company. It would surprise me
greatly if they did not, but perhaps they don't.

For those who keep trying to bash me for my "RTFM" comments I have no
apologies. Everyone here is an adult capable of making competent purchase
decisions. Decisions to update an OS should be made carefully and
deliberately. Since I need Fax I chose a version of Vista that provided it.
Do the same or stay with XP.

As I have said from the beginning, I understand the pain from those who have
been less careful. The fault is not entirely theirs. The fact that Fax has
been removed from Vista Home versions is documented, but only enough to
satisfy a lawyer (I always consider lawyers the lowest common denominator.
That's an occupational hazard for any physician): Look! There it is! It's in
footnote (ixivvi).

No way am I going to be the one to organize a protest. If I were, I would
follow Nigel's lead, only in a new thread each time to ensure the best
chance of being picked up by a search engine. Preceding the Subject with the
word "Protest" as Nigel did will also enable those of us trying to provide
real help move on to threads where we can actually do so. IMHO, Microsoft
needs to bring its marketing department up to speed. This is certainly one
case where they have missed the mark by a very wide margin.
--
Russ Valentine
[MVP-Outlook]
"Nigel Molesworth" wrote in message
...
On Sat, 17 Mar 2007 08:49:08 -0400, "Russ Valentine [MVP-Outlook]"
wrote:

Microsoft does not monitor these groups,
but it may still be reasonable to post your individual protest

I would certainly like to add my comments to the others. As has been
said before, it is unreasonable to expect "upgraders" to read all the
fine print, one expects more features in new system, not fewer.

I won't be advising any of my clients to upgrade their PCs until
Microsoft comes up with a solution.

--
Nigel M

You seem not understand USENET, public newsgroups, and the role of MVP's.
The mere fact that you would include MVP's in the same sentence with "rule
of marketing" testifies to that lack of understanding. Read more thoroughly
and think more carefully before you post your accusations.
--
Russ Valentine
[MVP-Outlook]
wrote in message
ups.com...
As a loyal Microsoft customer I find it very sad to read all the MVP
replies.

A basic rule of marketing is "the customer is always right". I am a
long-time customer, and I feel like I have been ripped off when a
feature which was available in Windows XP is no longer available in
the regular (or "cheap" if you like) versions of Windows Vista.

You can say as long as you want "read the fine-prints", "if you had
downloaded the large but free product manual you would have seen
that". However I do not read the fine prints of any product I buy. I
did read the comparison table at the Windows Vista home page, and it
said nothing about faxing. I have never planned to read a "large but
free" manual before making a choice of which version to buy.

You are calling the customers' complaints "bitching". This is very
insulting. It really feels like talking to a monopoly - "who cares
what the customer thinks, you should have known better." I know you
guys are not working for Microsoft, but you are holding a title given
by it and you do represent Microsoft in this newsgroup.

This is not the kind of attitude I am expecting to see from MVPs. You
can be helpful, link to alternative fax programs. If you can't be
helpful, you can just not reply.

On Mar 17, 2:49 pm, "Russ Valentine [MVP-Outlook]"
wrote:
To continue to warn those who are considering updating to Vista to read
the
fine print before they do. Those users who most frequently use the
WindowsFaxproduct will now be left without it if they don't. Users for
whom faxing
is important should stay with XP. I see a lot of folks who rush to the
latest releases just assuming it will be better or have more
features--not
always true.
It is not realistic to post here and expect anyone here to be able to
provide a solution for this issue. Microsoft does not monitor these
groups,
but it may still be reasonable to post your individual protest and leave
it
at that. Sometimes they do "mine the data" here when considering future
policies. I can't help but wonder that they aren't a bit surprised by
finding out how many people actually used and valued thefaxmodule.
--
Russ Valentine
[MVP-Outlook]"Brian" Brian @discussions.microsoft.com wrote in message

...



I agree with Susan. I need MicrosoftFax. I can't believe MS left it
out
of
Home Premium. Total BS. As for the Know It All, why post your smart
a$$
remarks on here?- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

I just downloaded Snappy Fax from their web site. 30 day free trial using
the full program and support. It's got more bells and whistles than the
WinFax Pro program that I was using with XP. It also is Vista compatible.
Cost to buy? About thirty bucks, I believe.

Regards
Barry

P.S. Although I was also surprised that a fax program was not included in
the Home Premium. Why they dropped it is a mystery to me.


wrote in message
ups.com...
On Feb 16, 12:55 am, "Russ Valentine [MVP-Outlook]"
wrote:
Not sure why you want me to comment. I have nothing to do with Microsoft.
If
you feel you were deliberately deceived by Microsoft's marketing, then
your
issue is with them, not me. You may well have a legitimate complaint
based
on what you saw and what you read. All I know is that when I did my
research
on version specific features, it was pretty clear to me which versions
includedfax:http://www.microsoft.com/windows/pro...footnotes.mspx

--
Russ Valentine
[MVP-Outlook]"Susan" wrote in message

...

I'd like you to look at this page and comment. scroll down to where it
says
"what programs have changed" specifically in reference to windowsfax
console andfaxand scan:
http://windowshelp.microsoft.com/Win...29171-8e24-1e6...
and please note the words at the top of the page which state "Applies
to
all
editions of WindowsVista."
"Russ Valentine [MVP-Outlook]" wrote:

You wanted to know how to view your old faxes. I told you. That was
your
only question. The rest was just a rant. I've always been puzzled by
users'
expectation that Windows should provide reliable, robustfaxsoftware as
part of the OS. Microsoft has done little to create that expectation
since
the software it has provided is neither reliable nor robust. Most
users
who
need tofaxpurchase a third party product, which you are certainly free
to
do. I can assure you thefaxfeature will not be added back into the
basic
versions ofVistain some sort of Service Pack, if that's what you're
asking. Features for each version were set long ago.
--
Russ Valentine
[MVP-Outlook]
"Susan" wrote in message
...
Russ, sorry I'm not as astute as you are. Your reply however, is
not
helpful. A slap on the wrist might make some feel superior, but
without
any
concrete suggestions to add to the string, is nothing more than a
slap
on
the
wrist, best to keep the chastising to yourself - it makes you sound
smug.

The bottom line is that the program is lacking a fundamental
communications
tool and without user input the developers will not know what areas
need
to
be addressed and included in future service packs.

"Russ Valentine [MVP-Outlook]" wrote:

Normally when making a purchase one looks at the features needed
and
purchases the appropriate version to meet one's needs. This
information
is
all well documented.
You can still view your old faxes quite readily. TIF files open in
Windows
Photo Gallery.
--
Russ Valentine
[MVP-Outlook]
"Susan" wrote in message
...
You have got to be kidding. I havevistahomepremiumbut I still
need
to
send and receive faxes!!!! I had this capability with XP, and I
am
very
upset
that it is not available withVistawhich I just installed
yesterday
Feb
3.
Does Microsoft believe thathomeusers never receive or send faxes?
What
are
my options? How am I to view the faxes I have saved in my
documents?
I
urgently need to have this capability on my computer and I am
sure I
am
not
alone in this need.

"John Barnett MVP" wrote:

It's doubtful, Microsoft, as far as i know, haven't supplied the
fax
software as a separate item for other versions of Windows
operating
systems.

You may have to look at third partyfaxapplications for this one.
Alternatively you would have to look to buyingVistaBusiness or
Ultimate
instead ofPremium.

--
John Barnett MVP
Associate Expert
Windows Shell/User

Web:http://xphelpandsupport.mvps.org
Web:http://vistasupport.mvps.org

The information in this mail/post is supplied "as is". No
warranty
of
any
kind, either expressed or implied, is made in relation to the
accuracy,
reliability or content of this mail/post. The Author shall not
be
liable
for
any direct, indirect, incidental or consequential damages
arising
out
of
the
use of, or inability to use, information or opinions expressed
in
this
mail/post..

"BoB Brazie" wrote in message
...
Thanks John. Do you suppose it might be available as a
separate
download
sometime for the other versions ofVista?

"John Barnett MVP" wrote in
message
...
Faxfacility is only available inVistaBusiness, Enterprise and
Ultimate.

Word 2007 provides plenty offaxcover templates but still
relies,
as
far
as i know, on thefaxsoftware ofVistaBusiness, Enterprise and
Ultimate. It doesn't contain afaxapplication on its own.

--
John Barnett MVP
Associate Expert
Windows Shell/User

Web:http://xphelpandsupport.mvps.org
Web:http://vistasupport.mvps.org

The information in this mail/post is supplied "as is". No
warranty
of
any
kind, either expressed or implied, is made in relation to the
accuracy,
reliability or content of this mail/post. The Author shall
not
be
liable
for any direct, indirect, incidental or consequential damages
arising
out
of the use of, or inability to use, information or opinions
expressed
in
this mail/post..

"BoB Brazie" wrote in message
...
Will some form of FAXing and scanning be available in
theHome
Premium
edition or only in the business edition.

I have need for both of these features but do not want the
business
edition.

Maybe they are available in the Office 2007 standard suite?

Thanks in advance. Bob.

I see.... Well lots of friends 're waiting for information on this
annoying fax mater... So, according to all above comments, we should
not upgrade to vista home premium. We'd better stay with our xp OS. XP
supports fax....

Many to choose from? None is more like it. Please advise me of a fax program
that works with Vista...
D

"bjr" wrote:

You should have read the list of features in each version before you
buy. That info has been available for about a year. The fax has NEVER
been part of Premium, only Ultimate and Business.
If fax software came with your modem, try installing that. Otherwise,
stop whining and go buy some fax software. There are many to choose from.

Susan wrote:
Russ, sorry I'm not as astute as you are. Your reply however, is not
helpful. A slap on the wrist might make some feel superior, but without any
concrete suggestions to add to the string, is nothing more than a slap on the
wrist, best to keep the chastising to yourself - it makes you sound smug.

The bottom line is that the program is lacking a fundamental communications
tool and without user input the developers will not know what areas need to
be addressed and included in future service packs.

"Russ Valentine [MVP-Outlook]" wrote:

Normally when making a purchase one looks at the features needed and
purchases the appropriate version to meet one's needs. This information is
all well documented.
You can still view your old faxes quite readily. TIF files open in Windows
Photo Gallery.
--
Russ Valentine
[MVP-Outlook]
"Susan" wrote in message
...
You have got to be kidding. I have vista home premium but I still need to
send and receive faxes!!!! I had this capability with XP, and I am very
upset
that it is not available with Vista which I just installed yesterday Feb
3.
Does Microsoft believe that home users never receive or send faxes? What
are
my options? How am I to view the faxes I have saved in my documents? I
urgently need to have this capability on my computer and I am sure I am
not
alone in this need.

"John Barnett MVP" wrote:

It's doubtful, Microsoft, as far as i know, haven't supplied the fax
software as a separate item for other versions of Windows operating
systems.

You may have to look at third party fax applications for this one.
Alternatively you would have to look to buying Vista Business or Ultimate
instead of Premium.

--
John Barnett MVP
Associate Expert
Windows Shell/User

Web: http://xphelpandsupport.mvps.org
Web: http://vistasupport.mvps.org

The information in this mail/post is supplied "as is". No warranty of any
kind, either expressed or implied, is made in relation to the accuracy,
reliability or content of this mail/post. The Author shall not be liable
for
any direct, indirect, incidental or consequential damages arising out of
the
use of, or inability to use, information or opinions expressed in this
mail/post..

"BoB Brazie" wrote in message
...
Thanks John. Do you suppose it might be available as a separate
download
sometime for the other versions of Vista?

"John Barnett MVP" wrote in message
...
Fax facility is only available in Vista Business, Enterprise and
Ultimate.

Word 2007 provides plenty of fax cover templates but still relies, as
far
as i know, on the fax software of Vista Business, Enterprise and
Ultimate. It doesn't contain a fax application on its own.

--
John Barnett MVP
Associate Expert
Windows Shell/User

Web: http://xphelpandsupport.mvps.org
Web: http://vistasupport.mvps.org

The information in this mail/post is supplied "as is". No warranty of
any
kind, either expressed or implied, is made in relation to the
accuracy,
reliability or content of this mail/post. The Author shall not be
liable
for any direct, indirect, incidental or consequential damages arising
out
of the use of, or inability to use, information or opinions expressed
in
this mail/post..

"BoB Brazie" wrote in message
...
Will some form of FAXing and scanning be available in the Home
Premium
edition or only in the business edition.

I have need for both of these features but do not want the business
edition.

Maybe they are available in the Office 2007 standard suite?

Thanks in advance. Bob.

How about snappyfax?

"Barry" wrote in message
...
I just downloaded Snappy Fax from their web site. 30 day free trial using
the full program and support. It's got more bells and whistles than the
WinFax Pro program that I was using with XP. It also is Vista compatible.
Cost to buy? About thirty bucks, I believe.

Regards
Barry

P.S. Although I was also surprised that a fax program was not included
in the Home Premium. Why they dropped it is a mystery to me.

They didn't included fax because its one of the small things that will
irritate people into wanting the better version. I think it adds up to
money. Microsoft found a way to sell their most expensive OS to everyone;
even folks who buy a new computer. New systems will probably come preloaded
with Home Basic or Premium and everyone will want to upgrade. MS gets to
sell the half baked OS to manufacturers and make even more when everyone
upgrades.

-Cedrick