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Vista machine freezes with mouse activity
Sometimes it's best to look beyond conventional wisdom.
A case in point is the oft used [and taken, by me as well] advice to obtain and install the most current drivers. Throughout the process of building a new machine I had carefully selected components, carefully assembled them, and carefully reviewed updates and installed those appropriate for the environment. You might then imagine my dismay when I discovered [probably by pure luck] that two copies of ATI2EVXX.exe were running, as reported by Task Manager. I'll spare the details in the interest of brevity, but suffice it to say that once I terminated those two modules, the freezing appears to have ceased. I'll probably follow some advice I received from Intel [perform a BIOS recovery and reinstall Raid drivers], and then wait a few more days before declaring this issue closed. The ATI response was underwhelming - something like, 'you may have come up with a circumvention... your problem 'may' be fixed in a future update... you may want to use a prior version of our drivers...' Thanks for nothing. We'll see. Anyway, thanks for listening and for your suggestions. "Spirit" wrote: I strongly suspect that it is your previous RAID setup that might be at the heart of this issue, Note how I have been preaching about hard drive utilities all along. Double check that you have followed the suggested removal method. Did you reformat and re-install? Be sure to test with only one drive running as well. Yes please let me know how it goes..... "MoosieAZ" wrote in message news Thanks for your extensive reply. I'll be conducting the memory test you suggest later today, and I'll check the Seagate site for any clues there. I've already ended many of the non-critical processes from TM and will monitor that throughout the day today. I did have a RAID 1 setup, but I reverted to 'IDE' mode [bios] because of the extensive verify time with each machine lock-up. The two Seagate 320s are running independently since Saturday. I'll keep you posted, thanks again. "Spirit" wrote: Memory tests will NOT check what I suggested.... the only way is as I described. Use one stick then the other and then try reversing their order. It only takes a very subtle difference in memory speed to create a condition such as you have. After the above, use Task Manager to Close as many programs as you can and then see if the problem continues. If you close most and the problem does stop use Defender and MSCONFIG to vary what loads and maybe you can find what if anything is causing your conflict. The reason you do the others first is that such an issue can be caused by one problem and aggravated by others. Please realize that even the most experienced system makers occasionally make a slight error that causes problems. Double and triple check your hard drive maker's site to absolutely ensure that they do not recommend some sort of utility be run, sometimes its a one time event until the next format. With super size disks these are not as uncommon as you might think and often they are harder to access than is reasonable. One indicator, though not 100% guarantee, is if the drives show a different formatted capacity than is normally expected. Another test is to run Sandra or other bench marks to compare the results to see if the drives are as responsive as they should be. Often such tests will do a quick or an extensive test, please run the extensive versions. Another real possibility, as crazy as this sounds, is to double check all cable connections. Actually remove them and then reconnect. Do not just try to snug them up. Another test is to remove all the hardware you can, such as a modem, the CD, DVD, 2nd hard disk (if possible) and so on and then try to see if the problem still exists. Do you by chance have a RAID setup? One of the problems in trying to suggest what you should do and in what order is I can't see the results of any methods as you do them. With experience comes the ability to "occasionally" hit on the right fix because of some subtle results of what might be considered a waste of effort test. KISS = Keep it Simple Stupid is the creedo of a modern troubleshooter. Meaning try to reduce the complexity to the simplest possible and start from there. Of course much easier to say than actually do. "MoosieAZ" wrote in message news As I've stated several times, all drivers are current. MS updates have been applied [yes, including the 2 you mentioned]. I just completed a second 3-hours of memory diagnostics with the latest version of memtest86+ - no errors. Since I was the system maker I can attest that no 'disk drive utilities' linger. Further, the system will freeze with no discernable disk activity. As I also mentioned, I have eliminated USB devices because I suspected there might be a connection. However, BIOS still has Legacy support enabled, so I'll change that. The following is unclear: "A simple method to test this is to CLOSE all you can in Task Manager and then check to see if still there. (CTRL + ALT + DEL)" - if what is still there? "Spirit" wrote: Yes I have a few suggestions and unless your drivers are totally up to date you are wasting both our times. The reason I first wanted to be sure you had actually updates all drivers is that with both a new system and a new OS there are just too many variables and you have to start cutting them out it a logical sequence. Double check to ensure there are NO hard drive utilities left off by system maker, this happens often with new drives and one symptom is hangs when running disk intensive programs. Have you installed these updates that improves the compatibility and reliability of Windows Vista http://support.microsoft.com/?kbid=938979 http://support.microsoft.com/?kbid=938194 The most common reason for the problem you describe are Mouse and Video Drivers with hard disk drivers/utilities being a close third. Go into your BIOS and turn OFF USB Legacy Support. You don't need this unless you have some older USB devices. Even if you do have some try it as test. There is always a possibity that you have a startup or other running programs that are in conflict and causing the issue. Startup Programs - Enable / Disable - Windows Defender - MSCONFIG http://www.vistax64.com/tutorials/79...e-disable.html A simple method to test this is to CLOSE all you can in Task Manager and then check to see if still there. (CTRL + ALT + DEL) How to troubleshoot Video Issues in Office http://support.microsoft.com/kb/907349/en-us To eliminate another real possibilty try using only 1/2 your RAM at a time. If they both work put the RAM back in in the REVERSE manner...... slot 1 in slot 2 and so on. This will work if the cause was one stick is slower than the other (even if both are rated same). "MoosieAZ" wrote in message ... I'm not 100% certain of your point. Since 95% of my new custom machine is Intel, yes, I updated the system with all the most current drivers from Intel. I also updated the ATI driver with the latest from ATI. If it isn't Intel or ATI, it came from MS, which is also up to date. Do you have specific suggestions, or are you just baiting. If its the former, I'm all ears; otherwise, please don't waste my time. "Spirit" wrote: So you have totally updated ALL your drivers? or just those easy to find? "MoosieAZ" wrote in message ... Thanks Spirit, I've already made those rounds. I did find one mouse related hotfix but it is not a very close match. Besides it is a pita to obtain hotfixes from Microsoft. "Spirit" wrote: Go to various maker's site and update all the drivers and utilities. Many Video and BT drivers have been updated in the last few weeks. If still an issue check the Microsoft Knowledge Base as there are possible hotfix's that might apply. "MoosieAZ" wrote in message ... I just posted this in the general area which may have been a mistake, so please accept my apology in advance; I'm relatively new at this posting stuff. My environment is Vista Ultimate running on an Intel D975XBX2 motherboard with an E6600 Core 2 Duo processor and 2GB of DDR2-PC6400 [800] memory; the graphics card is an ATI Radeon X1950 Pro-512MB. The situation is that the machine will freeze at different times [requiring a hard shutdown] most noticeably when I have double clicked on something. At first I suspected my Microsoft Desktop Elite mouse/keyboard for Bluetooth because the mouse would move erratically at times. I eliminated the Bluetooth devices [and dongle] and switched to a PS/2 keyboard and a USB wheel mouse. At first the problem seemed to go away, but that was misleading; it has returned with a vengeance. Just opening Outlook 2003 and clicking to open an email can often trigger the freeze. I have now eliminated all USB devices by installing a reliable PS/2 mouse. It has now been two hours without a lock-up. Yes, I have already installed the most current Intel BIOS and my Vista installation is current with updates, including the reliability / performance fixes released two weeks ago. Yes, I run an up-to-date CA A/V application as well as CounterSpy, and have run several different online scans without any malware being discovered. I certainly suspect driver involvement, especially the USB drivers, but I am uncertain how to proceed, or how to diagnose this problem any further. Any help from the driver and/or Intel experts out there will be most greatly appreciated. Thanks in advance. |
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Vista machine freezes with mouse activity
Glad you found it,,,, unusual problem for sure. Usually a driver will over-write
(after a reboot) or actually uninstall a previous driver so having two running is certainly unusual. You might want to boot into Safe Mode and take a look at all drivers that are available and delete any no longer used ones, if any. "MoosieAZ" wrote in message ... Sometimes it's best to look beyond conventional wisdom. A case in point is the oft used [and taken, by me as well] advice to obtain and install the most current drivers. Throughout the process of building a new machine I had carefully selected components, carefully assembled them, and carefully reviewed updates and installed those appropriate for the environment. You might then imagine my dismay when I discovered [probably by pure luck] that two copies of ATI2EVXX.exe were running, as reported by Task Manager. I'll spare the details in the interest of brevity, but suffice it to say that once I terminated those two modules, the freezing appears to have ceased. I'll probably follow some advice I received from Intel [perform a BIOS recovery and reinstall Raid drivers], and then wait a few more days before declaring this issue closed. The ATI response was underwhelming - something like, 'you may have come up with a circumvention... your problem 'may' be fixed in a future update... you may want to use a prior version of our drivers...' Thanks for nothing. We'll see. Anyway, thanks for listening and for your suggestions. "Spirit" wrote: I strongly suspect that it is your previous RAID setup that might be at the heart of this issue, Note how I have been preaching about hard drive utilities all along. Double check that you have followed the suggested removal method. Did you reformat and re-install? Be sure to test with only one drive running as well. Yes please let me know how it goes..... "MoosieAZ" wrote in message news Thanks for your extensive reply. I'll be conducting the memory test you suggest later today, and I'll check the Seagate site for any clues there. I've already ended many of the non-critical processes from TM and will monitor that throughout the day today. I did have a RAID 1 setup, but I reverted to 'IDE' mode [bios] because of the extensive verify time with each machine lock-up. The two Seagate 320s are running independently since Saturday. I'll keep you posted, thanks again. "Spirit" wrote: Memory tests will NOT check what I suggested.... the only way is as I described. Use one stick then the other and then try reversing their order. It only takes a very subtle difference in memory speed to create a condition such as you have. After the above, use Task Manager to Close as many programs as you can and then see if the problem continues. If you close most and the problem does stop use Defender and MSCONFIG to vary what loads and maybe you can find what if anything is causing your conflict. The reason you do the others first is that such an issue can be caused by one problem and aggravated by others. Please realize that even the most experienced system makers occasionally make a slight error that causes problems. Double and triple check your hard drive maker's site to absolutely ensure that they do not recommend some sort of utility be run, sometimes its a one time event until the next format. With super size disks these are not as uncommon as you might think and often they are harder to access than is reasonable. One indicator, though not 100% guarantee, is if the drives show a different formatted capacity than is normally expected. Another test is to run Sandra or other bench marks to compare the results to see if the drives are as responsive as they should be. Often such tests will do a quick or an extensive test, please run the extensive versions. Another real possibility, as crazy as this sounds, is to double check all cable connections. Actually remove them and then reconnect. Do not just try to snug them up. Another test is to remove all the hardware you can, such as a modem, the CD, DVD, 2nd hard disk (if possible) and so on and then try to see if the problem still exists. Do you by chance have a RAID setup? One of the problems in trying to suggest what you should do and in what order is I can't see the results of any methods as you do them. With experience comes the ability to "occasionally" hit on the right fix because of some subtle results of what might be considered a waste of effort test. KISS = Keep it Simple Stupid is the creedo of a modern troubleshooter. Meaning try to reduce the complexity to the simplest possible and start from there. Of course much easier to say than actually do. "MoosieAZ" wrote in message news As I've stated several times, all drivers are current. MS updates have been applied [yes, including the 2 you mentioned]. I just completed a second 3-hours of memory diagnostics with the latest version of memtest86+ - no errors. Since I was the system maker I can attest that no 'disk drive utilities' linger. Further, the system will freeze with no discernable disk activity. As I also mentioned, I have eliminated USB devices because I suspected there might be a connection. However, BIOS still has Legacy support enabled, so I'll change that. The following is unclear: "A simple method to test this is to CLOSE all you can in Task Manager and then check to see if still there. (CTRL + ALT + DEL)" - if what is still there? "Spirit" wrote: Yes I have a few suggestions and unless your drivers are totally up to date you are wasting both our times. The reason I first wanted to be sure you had actually updates all drivers is that with both a new system and a new OS there are just too many variables and you have to start cutting them out it a logical sequence. Double check to ensure there are NO hard drive utilities left off by system maker, this happens often with new drives and one symptom is hangs when running disk intensive programs. Have you installed these updates that improves the compatibility and reliability of Windows Vista http://support.microsoft.com/?kbid=938979 http://support.microsoft.com/?kbid=938194 The most common reason for the problem you describe are Mouse and Video Drivers with hard disk drivers/utilities being a close third. Go into your BIOS and turn OFF USB Legacy Support. You don't need this unless you have some older USB devices. Even if you do have some try it as test. There is always a possibity that you have a startup or other running programs that are in conflict and causing the issue. Startup Programs - Enable / Disable - Windows Defender - MSCONFIG http://www.vistax64.com/tutorials/79...e-disable.html A simple method to test this is to CLOSE all you can in Task Manager and then check to see if still there. (CTRL + ALT + DEL) How to troubleshoot Video Issues in Office http://support.microsoft.com/kb/907349/en-us To eliminate another real possibilty try using only 1/2 your RAM at a time. If they both work put the RAM back in in the REVERSE manner...... slot 1 in slot 2 and so on. This will work if the cause was one stick is slower than the other (even if both are rated same). "MoosieAZ" wrote in message ... I'm not 100% certain of your point. Since 95% of my new custom machine is Intel, yes, I updated the system with all the most current drivers from Intel. I also updated the ATI driver with the latest from ATI. If it isn't Intel or ATI, it came from MS, which is also up to date. Do you have specific suggestions, or are you just baiting. If its the former, I'm all ears; otherwise, please don't waste my time. "Spirit" wrote: So you have totally updated ALL your drivers? or just those easy to find? "MoosieAZ" wrote in message ... Thanks Spirit, I've already made those rounds. I did find one mouse related hotfix but it is not a very close match. Besides it is a pita to obtain hotfixes from Microsoft. "Spirit" wrote: Go to various maker's site and update all the drivers and utilities. Many Video and BT drivers have been updated in the last few weeks. If still an issue check the Microsoft Knowledge Base as there are possible hotfix's that might apply. "MoosieAZ" wrote in message ... I just posted this in the general area which may have been a mistake, so please accept my apology in advance; I'm relatively new at this posting stuff. My environment is Vista Ultimate running on an Intel D975XBX2 motherboard with an E6600 Core 2 Duo processor and 2GB of DDR2-PC6400 [800] memory; the graphics card is an ATI Radeon X1950 Pro-512MB. The situation is that the machine will freeze at different times [requiring a hard shutdown] most noticeably when I have double clicked on something. At first I suspected my Microsoft Desktop Elite mouse/keyboard for Bluetooth because the mouse would move erratically at times. I eliminated the Bluetooth devices [and dongle] and switched to a PS/2 keyboard and a USB wheel mouse. At first the problem seemed to go away, but that was misleading; it has returned with a vengeance. Just opening Outlook 2003 and clicking to open an email can often trigger the freeze. I have now eliminated all USB devices by installing a reliable PS/2 mouse. It has now been two hours without a lock-up. Yes, I have already installed the most current Intel BIOS and my Vista installation is current with updates, including the reliability / performance fixes released two weeks ago. Yes, I run an up-to-date CA A/V application as well as CounterSpy, and have run several different online scans without any malware being discovered. I certainly suspect driver involvement, especially the USB drivers, but I am uncertain how to proceed, or how to diagnose this problem any further. Any help from the driver and/or Intel experts out there will be most greatly appreciated. Thanks in advance. |
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